I really, really like this concept! (I also like the term "presentation service" in this context - separation of concerns and all... )
> "Not everyone can host their own content." [...] use banks
Indeed - this isn't much different from using an OpenID provider.
It's also worth noting our previous discussion around the possibility of an additional layer to separate storage from URL provider (sort of like DNS, where the IP of the server can be changed if necessary).
> I then give that URL to Flickr
Presumably, $service (e.g. Flickr) needs to create a local copy of your $entity (e.g. photo), essentially caching it so they can do indexing and stuff. That, of course, introduces complexity and potential for failure - for example, if you update your $entity, would you send a PUT to notify $service?
I'd very much like to see a proof of concept illustrating what this might look like in practice...
Joe Andrieu
· 6 months ago
Great post. I've been working on some of this with Doc Searls and http://projectvrm.org.
I wish I'd seen "Invert the web" before I wrote that. It is exactly what I was getting at, and the main buzz I was spreading at SXSW.
Great to see your interpretation of similar ideas. This is definitely the future of the web. Perhaps even more so as Google's idea of the Wave is explored by more and more people.
cdent
· 6 months ago
The problem with a proof of concept of this, or any implementation, is getting participation from presentation services. For a demo one would probably have to create that too.
FND
· 6 months ago
Sure, but we could probably take something like Laconica (or even Django) to come up with a quick hack for demonstration purposes.
brier
· 6 months ago
There is some additional interesting reading regarding this from Jon Udell, who calls it "hosted lifebits".
I think Udell's main focus is permanence (which is important) but lately I keep coming up hard against wanting, as you say, content by reference.
For example, I've got my photos locked up on a slow iMac upstairs in iPhoto, I can't get at them usefully from my Linux laptop, where I reside most often. My family want to see them, and they really don't want to have to wait 9 months for be to block out the time to sit at the iMac, fix them all up and publish them somewhere. So, I finally said screw it and began publishing them to Flickr directly, so they could be seen raw, with the idea that I'd fix them all up with Picnik as I had time.
Only now I've got differences between Flickr and iPhoto and no easy way to reconcile them. I could just dump iPhoto, and do everything with Flickr and Picnik, but Picnik isn't too quick and besides, iPhoto is a pretty nice application. I could switch to Picasa and Picasaweb, but then I'm stuck there with that software.
And then besides all this there's the fact that now I have to frickin' upload them to Facebook as well.
So, I'm actively jonesing for a content bank, or hosted lifebits service, or Permanent Record™ (steal that and I'll cut you), where I can store all my photos permanently and just point iPhoto, Flickr, Picnik, Facebook, whatever towards to gain miscellaneous utility.
I think it's inevitable. I hope we're starting to see the first signs of it coming.
All Comments
(I also like the term "presentation service" in this context - separation of concerns and all... )
> "Not everyone can host their own content." [...] use banks
Indeed - this isn't much different from using an OpenID provider.
It's also worth noting our previous discussion around the possibility of an additional layer to separate storage from URL provider (sort of like DNS, where the IP of the server can be changed if necessary).
> I then give that URL to Flickr
Presumably, $service (e.g. Flickr) needs to create a local copy of your $entity (e.g. photo), essentially caching it so they can do indexing and stuff.
That, of course, introduces complexity and potential for failure - for example, if you update your $entity, would you send a PUT to notify $service?
I'd very much like to see a proof of concept illustrating what this might look like in practice...
Check out the initial post (two years ago) on the idea of a personal datastore
http://blog.joeandrieu.com/2007/06/14/vrm-the-u...
This was the paradigm that attracted me to TiddlyWiki in the first place.
More recently, I kicked off a series of articles with this introduction:
http://blog.joeandrieu.com/2009/04/24/the-great...
I wish I'd seen "Invert the web" before I wrote that. It is exactly what I was getting at, and the main buzz I was spreading at SXSW.
Great to see your interpretation of similar ideas. This is definitely the future of the web. Perhaps even more so as Google's idea of the Wave is explored by more and more people.
I think Udell's main focus is permanence (which is important) but lately I keep coming up hard against wanting, as you say, content by reference.
For example, I've got my photos locked up on a slow iMac upstairs in iPhoto, I can't get at them usefully from my Linux laptop, where I reside most often. My family want to see them, and they really don't want to have to wait 9 months for be to block out the time to sit at the iMac, fix them all up and publish them somewhere. So, I finally said screw it and began publishing them to Flickr directly, so they could be seen raw, with the idea that I'd fix them all up with Picnik as I had time.
Only now I've got differences between Flickr and iPhoto and no easy way to reconcile them. I could just dump iPhoto, and do everything with Flickr and Picnik, but Picnik isn't too quick and besides, iPhoto is a pretty nice application. I could switch to Picasa and Picasaweb, but then I'm stuck there with that software.
And then besides all this there's the fact that now I have to frickin' upload them to Facebook as well.
So, I'm actively jonesing for a content bank, or hosted lifebits service, or Permanent Record™ (steal that and I'll cut you), where I can store all my photos permanently and just point iPhoto, Flickr, Picnik, Facebook, whatever towards to gain miscellaneous utility.
I think it's inevitable. I hope we're starting to see the first signs of it coming.
http://www.jasonkolb.com/weblog/2006/08/reinven...